Category: interview

Interview #17: Former San Francisco, CA Board of Supervisors President David Chiu (with podcast)

This podcast interview is available on iTunes, Stitcher, Player FM and right here:

David Chiu was president of San Francisco’s Board of Supervisors (their term for “city council”) from 2009-2014. If you know ANYTHING about San Francisco, it’s that things can get weird there. And believe me: Chiu has seen plenty of weirdness. Now a state assemblymember, he talked to me about nudists, F-bombs, and his out-of-body experience.

—

Q: Your Board of Supervisors has a famously unruly public comment period. What are some of the more quintessentially San Francisco moments that you remember?

A: Oh, yes. We had a debate about whether our residents could walk around naked. I remember when the vote didn’t go the way that the nudist activists wanted, they protested by disrobing in the chamber in front of the television. There are a number of individuals who are regular public commenters. We have Walter, who likes to sing. Another individual had a very Christian conservative message.

Q: In January 2009 when you got on the Board, on your very first day you were chosen as president. Had you ever been to a Board meeting before you got elected?

A: I had.

Q: And what about that meeting made you think, “I want one of the most aggravating jobs in San Francisco?”

A: [Laughs] At that time, San Francisco City Hall was pretty darn dysfunctional. We had elected officials who could not stand to be in the same room as each other, who would bicker through the press. And I thought we could do a better job of trying to bring folks together.

Q: When you walked up to the president’s chair, the first thing you said was, “this is unexpected.” Was it REALLY unexpected? When you left the house that morning, what odds were you giving yourself? Be honest.

A: Extremely low. At the exact moment when the clerk said I had the six votes to become president, I had one of those out-of-body experiences. It slowly dawned on me that someone had been elected Board president. And I then realized, “oh, my god. I think it might have been…me!”

david_chiu_0
Former San Francisco Board of Supervisors President David Chiu

Q: Were there any supervisors who were consistently thorns in your side? And followup question, it was Chris Daly wasn’t it?

A: Well, he did threaten to haunt me for the rest of my political career and uttered a very famous phrase in San Francisco to me, saying, “it’s on like Donkey Kong.”

Q: …

A: [He] was famous in his last year for saying that he was going to drop an F-bomb in every meeting. After he said that, I decided to go and purchase a bar of soap which I very publicly gave to him.

Q: Nice. So now you are in California Assembly. Which has more comfortable chairs, the Board of Supervisors or the state Assembly?

A: I think the Board of Supervisors is actually a little more comfortable.

Q: So when you’re sitting in your objectively inferior Assembly chair–

A: I would say “older”…less ergonomically-fitted chair.

Q: –do you think, “I am so glad I don’t have to sit through another g–d– Board of Supervisors meeting?” Or are you thinking, “what I wouldn’t give to trade this for a Board meeting?”

A: [Laughs] It’s just a very different experience. Very different ambiance.

Follow Assemblymember David Chiu on Twitter: @DavidChiu

Interview #16: Homer, AK Mayor Beth Wythe (with podcast)

This podcast interview is available on iTunes, Stitcher, Player FM and right here:

Beth Wythe has been mayor and city council member in Homer for eight years–and yesterday was actually her last day at city hall. I wanted to get her parting thoughts on everything from breaking tie votes to silencing talkative people…to salmon. Yes, salmon.

—

Q: Fill in the blank for me: if Homer city council meetings were an animal, they would be a ________.

A: [Laughs] I have to think about that because they can be anything.

Q: What is the hardest part about being in charge of a council meeting?

A: I don’t have a difficulty with it. I do have council members that really want their opinion to be the dominating opinion. And then you have other council members that are a little more withdrawn. And you want to draw them out.

Q: So if someone is monopolizing the discussion, how do you gently nudge them to give the other people some space to get in?

A: The rule of order is that you get to have your say and you get to have one response. You can’t just go back and forth. I will just say, “excuse me, this [other] person would like to have something to say.”

Q: When you were just a council member, were you more talkative or less talkative?

A: I just don’t like to argue in public. Even as the mayor I don’t try to make my opinion the stronger one.

Q: The mayor does not have a vote at city council meetings–

A: Only in the case of a tie.

Q: Right, which doesn’t happen often?

12829110_479659545554378_6065610996191460541_o
Homer, AK Mayor Beth Wythe

A: More frequently than you might think. Where that can be frustrating for the community is that I’m a very conservative person. And so when it comes to me deciding, it’s, like, always going to fall on the conservative side of the table. It’s better for the community if there is good consensus with the council.

Q: So you prefer not casting a vote if it means everyone else is on the same page?

A: Right.

Q: That’s very self-sacrificing of you.

A: I think it’s not about me. When it becomes about “I need to have a vote” and “I need to have my voice heard”–when it becomes about the mayor, I think the mayor’s not doing their job.

Q: Does anyone get prone to hyperbole and threaten to walk out?

A: Right now, we don’t have anyone on the council that does not function in a professional capacity. It’s not like you have housewives–which wouldn’t be a bad thing–but it’s not like you have housewives or people that are not accustomed to conducting a business meeting.

Q: Mmhmm.

A: I’m still thinking about the animal thing. And I haven’t come up with one!

Q: Let’s try to come up with one together.

A: Think of something mellow. It’s not like the yippie dog that needs all the attention. We’re not that.

Q: Cats are fairly mellow. But they’re also sleepy and lazy and they can scratch you.

A: Yeah…

Q: Goldfish are mellow.

A: We are a fishing society. Maybe we’re salmon. There are lots of varieties and they’re highly valued. I’m going with salmon!

Interview #15: Rochester, NY Council Vice President Dana Miller (with podcast)

As usual, you  can listen to this podcast interview on iTunes, Stitcher, Player FM or right here:

This is a fun one! Rochester city council Vice President Dana Miller filled me in on what kind of vice president he is (hint: not a Dan Quayle) and how there is fierce competition between the public commenters at council meetings.

—

Q: How is being the vice president of the Rochester city council similar to being vice president of the United States?

A: The jobs are similar in that the vice president of city council and the vice president of the United States serve as a backup for the president.

Q: Do you see yourself more as a Joe Biden or a Dick Cheney?

A: It’s interesting–I met Joe Biden. It turns out, we both have two sons, we were both married in 1977, we both have sisters named Valerie who worked on our campaigns. So I find myself having an affinity for Joe Biden and being there as a person who could step in for the president–and not necessarily be a shadowy figure who’s actually pulling the strings.

Q: “Shadowy figure?” Sir, are you telling me that you have never shot one of your friends in the face while bird hunting?

A: I can absolutely say with certainty that I have not shot any of my friends in the face while bird hunting.

danamiller.jpg
Rochester, NY Council Vice President Dana Miller

Q: Do you bring a different personality or energy to the meetings when you preside?

A: I would like to think so. We have a session before the council meeting starts called Speak to Council where people can talk about any topic they want. I like to ensure that people are knowing they are welcome to be there. I like to give them some eye contact.

Q: Mmhmm.

A: We have the A List, which are things that are going to be discussed that evening. And the B List, which is everything else. The A Listers get to go first. The B Listers tend to be people who come to every council meeting and they always have something to discuss. The B Listers kind of compete to see who is going to be the last speaker. That’s interesting to watch.

Q: For the other council members, are they behaving like their normal selves on camera, or are we seeing a different version of them?

A: One of the fears of the cameras was that people would be different. When I first joined council, I argued for the fact that we should broadcast the meeting. I was greeted with “over my dead body” by some people–all of whom are no longer on council.

Q: Wow.

A: There was a great fear that people would be playing to the cameras or going on long-winded diatribes just to get airtime. I’ve not really seen that.

Q: The Rochester City council has a newsletter. And the name of the newsletter…I want to pronounce this correctly…THE CITY COUNCIL CHRONICLE! Who do I have to talk to to get that named changed?!

A: I would encourage you to sign up for the B List and make your case. I’m sure we would listen intently.

Follow Councilman Dana Miller on Twitter: @dkmiller26

Interview #14: Bangor, ME Councilor Joe Baldacci (with podcast)

This is our second podcast interview which, as a reminder, is available on iTunes, Stitcher, and Player FM. You can also listen right here:

I talked to Bangor city councilor Joe Baldacci about city council dress codes, whether he preferred being mayor, and what it was like being 20 years younger than everyone else when first elected.

—

Q: You were elected to the Bangor city council in 1996. How were council meetings different in the 1990s than they are today? And feel free to quote Backstreet Boys lyrics in your answer.

A: [Laughs] They were not televised in the 1990s. They were more informal, I think you would say. Because they’re televised and recorded now, there’s always an assurance we’re making to make sure it’s fully transparent. That all things are discussed in public. Twenty years ago, I don’t think that same care was taken.

Q: What do you wear to city council meetings, and what do you think the dress code should be?

A: I think that on occasion, having buttoned-up short-sleeved shirts are fine. This is a part-time city council, we all have jobs outside of city council. Half the time I’m wearing a suit and tie, and half the time I’m maybe wearing a suit without tie or just a button-down shirt. It’s not overly formal.

Q: I always thought that in Maine, a short-sleeved buttoned-down shirt was the most formal you could be. Apparently, I was wrong. Okay, so you were mayor from 1998-1999. Which did you like better: being the mayor or a regular councilor?

A: Well, as a regular councilor you can be a little more, honestly, outspoken on issues. As the mayor, your focus really is trying to ensure consensus and stability.

Q: So it sounds like you’re just fine with being regular Joe Councilman? Literally, Joe Councilman.

A: The mayor doesn’t have any more votes than I do. It’s a ceremonial position more or less. It’s an honor. It’s all good. It’s just that as an individual councilor, you can push issues.

jbaldacci
Bangor, ME Councilor Joe Baldacci

Q: Your brother was also a Bangor city councilor who went on to be a congressman and governor of Maine. Is there any rivalry between the two of you where he says, “YOU’RE just a councilman. I was governor!” And you go “Yeah, you WERE. At least I’m still on the city council!”

A: [Laughs] No, John’s been very supportive.

Q: What advice did he give you when you were elected?

A: He told me to listen to the people that had been there many, many years. I was 31 and kind of a newbie. I think after me, everyone was in their 50s, 60s, or 70s.

Q: Wait, that’s a 20-year age gap. Did you feel any burden to prove you were mature enough to be on the council with these much older people?

A: Yes. Yeah, definitely. Especially the first year.

Q: If you caught some lobster and had a boil party at your house, who would you invite over to share it with?

A: Probably Councilor Perry…Councilor Graham…Councilor Faircloth…and–

Q: You can’t name all of them. You have to pick a favorite.

A: I like all of them equally!

Q: If I was talking to you in your first year, you would’ve picked a favorite. But you’re more diplomatic now.

A: Exactly.

Follow Councilor Joe Baldacci on Twitter: @JoeBaldacci

Interview #13: Anchorage, AK Assembly Chair Elvi Gray-Jackson (with podcast)

Big news! For the first time, you can now listen to a City Council Chronicles interview in podcast form. Follow this link to City Council Chronicles on iTunes or click play:

It’s a very special interview, in which we travel way, way up to Anchorage and talk to the chair of the city’s assembly, Elvi Gray-Jackson. She told me about the betting pool she runs on the council and how she cold-calls audience members for the Pledge of Allegiance.

—

Q: How many people usually show up to the assembly meetings? And because this is Alaska, how many grizzly bears show up?

A: How many grizzly bears? You mean rude people?

Q: I didn’t know that was the euphemism. I was talking about actual grizzly bears. Either one.

A: Literal bears, no. On average we have an audience of about 100, maybe 120. For every meeting I’ll estimate what time I think we’re gonna end the meeting. There’s about six of us–when I get to the meeting tonight I’ll say, “okay, what’s your guess?” We have fun trying to guess what time the meeting’s going to end. And somebody wins.

Q: You run a betting pool for the meeting end times?

A: It’s just for fun.

Q: Who usually wins?

PA: I win a lot. Lately, some of my colleagues are getting pretty good at it. I like to make the meetings lively and fun. What I do different than what any other chair has done–usually after roll call we do the Pledge of Allegiance. And every other chair usually asks one of our colleagues to lead us. What I decided I was gonna do is, every meeting I’m going to arbitrarily pick somebody in the audience to come up to the podium and lead us. I like to engage the public.

egj
Anchorage, AK Assembly Chair Elvi Gray-Jackson

Q: It’s Alaska, so I’m assuming people are allowed to bring guns to the assembly meetings?

A: That’s an interesting question…yes. People are allowed to bring guns.

Q: So how many guns do you have on your person while chairing the meetings?

A: I don’t have a gun. I’m terrified of guns. Dick Traini, who’s my vice chair now, when he was chair, he had the dais area bullet-proofed. And I was thankful for that.

Q: Are there some council members who are thorns in your side?

A: I’m a dolphin. Dolphins could kill sharks. Dolphins always have a dolphin expression on their face and the sharks are constantly doing things to try and change that personality. But the dolphins just maintain it and the sharks finally calm down. In that respect, there are human sharks. I don’t let people push my buttons.

Q: …That’s an analogy I have never heard from anyone else before.

A: And I have a dolphin tattoo on my left shoulder.

Q: Last September you missed an assembly meeting because you were introducing Michelle Obama at the White House. Looking back, do you regret not being there to vote on the contract for the reservoir mixer phase II upgrades?

A: Absolutely no, I don’t regret not being there. I was representing Anchorage. I plan my entire life around my assembly meetings because I don’t want to miss them. We have the opportunity to do the assembly meetings by phone. I HATE doing assembly meetings by phone because you get elected and you need to do your job.

Interview #12: Jefferson City, MO Mayor Carrie Tergin

Last month was International #CityHallSelfie Day, and one particular mid-council meeting collage caught my eye:

Turns out, this artwork came from Jefferson City, Missouri’s shutterbug Mayor Carrie Tergin. We got deep into selfies, public comments, and whether mayors are important.

—

Q: How many times per week do you take mayoral selfies?

A: Boy, I wish I counted! I’m a pretty active mayor. I have a big Facebook following. If I’m at an event and people see me, they say, “we want to get a selfie with the mayor!” It’s just kinda become my thing!

Q: Has anyone ever called you the Kim Kardashian of Central Missouri?

A: [Laughs] No! I’ve never, ever, ever had that impression, actually.

Q: Let’s try to make that a thing. In what circumstances other than #CityHallSelfie Day would you take a selfie during a council meeting?

A: That’s NEVER happened until City Council Selfie day. We’re at at the pre-meeting and–I have to give credit to two other council representatives: Councilwoman [Erin] Wiseman and Councilman [Ken] Hussey–both said during our pre-meeting, “did you know today’s #CityHallSelfie Day?” And I said, “What?!” That was not even on my radar! So they’re all laughing, then we went over to council chambers and took more selfies.

Q: We have some footage of those selfies:

A: When we present proclamations or if we have a group there, I always try to stop and say, “hey let’s get a picture.” Then I post it and share it. I know the council probably would say, “here she goes again, getting out her camera.” But for some people that come to city council to talk about what’s important to them, this is their moment to shine.

Q: And it might be the only time that person comes to a city council meeting, so you make it count. Which reminds me, during an interview in 2015, you said this:

tergin

How often did you show up to comment at city council meetings?

A: Probably several times a year. As we found the city taking down some older homes, I found myself at the podium a lot.

Q: What advice would you give Carrie Tergin, the public commenter, at being better at influencing Carrie Tergin, the mayor?

A: I think the key is to be precise and…

Q: Brief?

A: Focused. Brief is part of that. People come before the council and they don’t necessarily know what they’re asking for.

Q: At council meetings, what’s the difference between being mayor and a regular council member?

A: The mayor presides over the meeting, but doesn’t have a vote unless it’s a tie. Some would say, “you don’t have a vote, so are you really that important?” Absolutely. Even a mayor without a vote still is charged with guiding the council. The [former Mayor John] Landwehr Rule was, “you’re not gonna clap and you’re not gonna boo.”

Q: As mayor, do you now see public commenters from your days as a citizen and still have a connection with them?

A: Oh, yeah. Some of those folks that, we were together championing causes back in the early to mid-2000s, we’re still saying, “wow, look at how much we’re accomplishing now.”

Q: Do you think they see you as the one who “made it?”

A: No, it’s not about me. I think what they see is that they supported me, and their support is what was key.

Follow Mayor Carrie Tergin on Twitter: @CarrieTergin

Interview #11: Asheville, NC Mayor Esther Manheimer

Watching the Asheville city council meeting last month, I noticed the particularly steady guidance of Mayor Esther Manheimer. What was her deal? How does a first-term mayor run such smooth meetings?

In this interview, Her Honor told me about gaining confidence, her fascination with tribal customs, and when she ejected a troublemaker.

—

Q: Before you were mayor, you were a regular council member. How are council meetings different now that you’re in charge?

A: You’re of more of a facilitator. You’re making sure everyone has their voice heard. You can’t just space out. If you’re a council member, you can choose to just not know any of that.

Q: When you were a council member, did you avoid knowing the rules?

A: No, no, no. I love all things Roberts Rules. Especially with my anthropology major as an undergrad–tribal customs.

Q: What’s the most well-run city council meeting you’ve seen besides, obviously, the ones you run?

A: As a lawyer, I have appeared before many county commissions and city council meetings. I like a well-run meeting where the chair keeps the questions focused. Sometimes you can watch it unfold in front of you and they’re veering off into territory that’s not even in front of them and the chair is not controlling that.

Q: When you were just a council member, how did the mayor run meetings compared to your style?

A: She did not corral the troops ahead of the meetings, so it was a little more chaotic. I try to make sure we’re prepared.

manheimer
Asheville, NC Mayor Esther Manheimer

Q: Your previous mayor was a city council member, then mayor. You were a city council member, now mayor. Do you ever look from side to side at a meeting and think, “which one of these people is coming for my job?”

A: Not DURING the meeting but…[laughs] I definitely wonder, are there other folks who want to become the next mayor of Asheville? And then I think, do I wanna run for mayor again?

Q: …

A: …

Q: …DO you wanna run for mayor again?

A: I don’t know. I have three young kids. Politician, mommy–plus I’m a full-time working lawyer.

Q: It’s hard to have it all. Speaking of the other council members, do they act differently in private than they do on camera?

A: Oh yeah. Very different. I have the newer council members that are learning more about getting their voice and saying their opinion loud and clear in public. That’s a process every newly-elected person has to go through. And it’s a little scary.

Q: It’s also scary during public comment when people are calling you liars and con artists. How do you decide when to say something and when to just sit there?

A: We have gotten to know who is going to be constantly disappointed with us no matter what. To respond every time almost elevates the comment. I don’t think when we’re being told we’re liars, to say, “oh, I’m not a liar” is helpful. I won’t respond in those situations. Now, if someone is providing incorrect information, I will clarify it. Because there might be three people watching and so–apparently you’re watching, too. So, four people.

Q: Darn right.

A: The first time I had to throw somebody out of the meeting, I had him removed because he was directing his comments at staff and not at us. He was staring at the staff and I warned him several times that’s not appropriate.

Follow Mayor Esther Manheimer on Twitter: @EstherManheimer

Interview #10: Hampton, VA City Council Clerk Katherine Glass

Hampton’s city council clerk had some FUN stories, so let’s get to it! Katherine Glass told me about how to get the key to the city and the time she almost clotheslined President Obama.

—

Q: You’ve got a city council meeting in 48 hours–what was today like for you?

A: The mayor popped in and saw a group that does youth sports. He suggested that they come to a council meeting, but we already have three groups coming to be recognized. And two more got added. So I’ve got to figure out how we accommodate five groups and make everybody feel welcome, but we still get the business of the city done.

Q: Yeah, I don’t envy you.

A: My workflow is one week I’m getting ready for a meeting–or I’m having a meeting. We’re highly automated. I think Hampton was the second city in the country to go to iPad technology for meetings.

Q: You’re a trendsetter!

A: It came from [former] Mayor Molly Ward. She worked for the Obama administration for a while. I got to go and have lunch at the White House. Like, in the West Wing dining room! Very, very cool.

Q: Did you meet the president?

A: I wouldn’t say MEET him…we almost collided with him.

Q: You gotta tell me what happened.

A: I had just asked Molly, “do you pass Obama in the hall?” She goes, “not really.” I swear to you, not five minutes later, Molly was leading the way, [former city attorney] Cynthia [Hudson] was behind me, and I see all these men in black. And by the time I look back, Cynthia is at the intersection and he [Obama] just about runs into her.

Q: Oh, no.

A: And he says, “Hello!” She goes “Hello!” I was like, “that’s the flipping President of the United States! I could reach out and touch him!”

kglass
Hampton, VA city council clerk Katherine Glass

Q: When you look at this city council, do you see any future White House officials? Congresspeople? A president?

A: Not in this group. I think they’re serving out of a love to the city. You’ve got two retirees…Teresa Schmidt is actually a preschool administrator…Billy Hobbs runs an automotive dealership. Everybody knows Billy. He’s just your average guy.

Q: So how do you describe your job?

A: Departments compile their information. They get it to me. I make sure it looks right and I put it in a packet. The packet goes out to council on Friday, so they have a good five days to review everything. My job while I’m at the meeting is to record their votes. I make sure the mayor signs all the new laws. I’m the funnel.

Q: “The funnel,” nice.

A: It’s an interesting job. You get calls from weird reporters that are like, “hey, I’m gonna watch your meeting.”

Q: Ugh, I hate those people.

A : Have you ever heard of Mark Malkoff?

Q: Nope.

A: He called with a bizarre request. He asked me, “what do you have to do to get the key to the city?” I’m like, I don’t know that we really have a key to the city! His thing was to do a road trip across the country and see how many keys to the city he could collect.

Q: Katherine. How does City Council Chronicles get a key to the city?

A: Something terribly creative.

Q: What about…I review your city council meeting and you mention City Council Chronicles DURING the meeting?

A: I can ask the mayor…I’ll see if Donnie can do that in his mayor’s comments.

Q: THANK YOU SO MUCH.

Interview #9: Paducah, KY Reporter Lauren Duncan

Grab your banjo and hop a freight train with me down to Paducah, Kentucky. Home to Dippin’ Dots, the Paducah International Raceway, and the National Quilt Museum, y’all best mosey on over to city hall, where every Tuesday night Paducah Sun reporter Lauren Duncan watches the city commission meetings.

She talked to me about how everyone always gets along…or do they?

—

Q: How long have you been covering the city commission?

A: I have been here just two years–and today is my last day.

Q: Oh, no way!

A: I’ve got a city commission meeting tonight and [then] I’ve got a job in Chicago.

Q: Do you think the commissioners are planning a surprise party for you?

A: I don’t, but they have all been very kind to me. Paducah is a pretty small town–I run into them out and about.

Q: When you see them outside of council meetings, is it like when you were in school and you would see your teacher in the grocery store and it would feel super weird?

A: Haha, I get what you’re saying. One of our commissioners, he owns a coffee shop in town and so he is just one of your popular neighborhood guys. But he’s also the commissioner who get the most votes every year. He’s one of those people where if I weren’t a reporter, I’d probably be friends with him, you know?

Picture1
Paducah, KY city council reporter Lauren Duncan

A: This town is just like a PBS special. Our city commissioner who owns the coffee shop…we’ve got a train down by our river, and they were going to get rid of it because it was falling apart. He went out and painted it all up himself. He spent, like, a month with his wide-brimmed hat out there on top of the train.

Q: So I’m assuming everyone is pretty friendly during city commission meetings?

A: There has not been a single shouting match between the commissioners or the mayor or the city manager. That is mind boggling to me.

Q: It sounds like the “Stepford Wives”–everyone is happy and cookie cutter.

A: A lot of stuff happens behind closed doors. All of our meetings are live broadcast and I think there’s sort of a fear to have frank discussions.

Q: Is that a southern thing? A small city thing?

A: That’s something I’ve never seen before. I think it’s literally just the fact that they’re being televised and they’re nervous about public perception of having a heated debate that people can see.

Q: Suppose you and your best friend sign up for a cooking class, but she gets sick and has to cancel. Which commissioner would you invite to do the cooking class with you?

A: You’re basically asking who’s my favorite!

Q: Sure. Or who makes a great casserole.

A: That’s easy because he’s one of the most personable guys in town: it’s Allan Rhodes, the commissioner who owns the coffee shop and paints the trains.

Q: All around good guy. Regular Mr. Rogers.

A: He was the first guy I talked to here. I was looking for a place to live. Someone said, “talk to Allan Rhodes.” And he gave me all kinds of advice for moving here!

Q: Well, I hope there’s another Allan Rhodes waiting for you in Chicago.

Follow Lauren Duncan on Twitter: @LaurenPDuncan